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mistake problems 2.0 1.9 fans new players paradox

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Dr_Ar_MG #1 Posted 04 May 2018 - 04:29 PM

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the main problem of 1.9 was that the game had low population, because new players got frustrated with poor results. they left the game before they could learn tactics.

they couldn't enjoy game... it was like that go to the battle die or defeat and again..

 

 

so keep the problem in your mind .the problem is new players get frustrated with poor result they leave before they learn

 

paradox 1: 2.0 fans believe, all tactics and self skills in 1.9 still are possible and useful in 2.0... so if we suppose they are right .... WG just added some new strange rules of capturing bases, some new complex rules which are not clear for everybody.

now in 2.0 the new players has one more problem than 1.9! they needed to learn tactics and know planes specs and behaviors and they need to know new rules ( rules which are really unfair). it harder for them to know behaviors of different planes( in 1.9 they could compare the speed,alt,HP,firepower.. etc) in the lists and when they locked on opposite plane. now they can't. thy have to learn it in hangar or on tech tree page...

 

so in 2.0 WG just made it harder to learn and know plane behaviors, they need to learn tactics,+ new rules new strategy

got it? new players got frustrated because they couldn't learn tactics and know planes.. now its harder to learn and they need to learn new rules and strategies.

 


we proved that game is unfair because of the bots, one side human player play much better than other human but defeats

 

paradox 2:  .they believe if 2.0 had more player so less bot game game becomes more fair,it's completely wrong.. it's random and depends on your luck to have good teammates or not. if the game was full of human players it was much more unfair. depends on your luck some times a noob team and definitely a defeat... no matter how much you try. and sometimes a good team, you can be AFK and win. in 1.9 when a good player had bad team it was a challenging victory with 10 kills and always there was a way to victory without your team. now everything depends on your team and new players couldn't know why they are loser or winner. some times they play bad but victory sometimes try hard but defeat.

 


 they believe 1.9 wasn't successful due to low population... but now the number of 2 players is half of 1.9. how can it be a step to the front?


 most of players has left the game but they believe the game is now better !!!

 

 


Edited by Dr_Ar_MG, 04 May 2018 - 04:31 PM.


BravelyRanAway #2 Posted 04 May 2018 - 05:58 PM

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Best just to shut down the game altogether. There wasn't enough after many years to financially support 1.9 and that wasn't going to change with 2.0 because the WoWP's name is too jaded and tarnished. There are too few devs working on this new game version to bring it up to scratch and it has so many bugs that'll drive new players away before they even get to learn the game. Then they can shut down the forum as well which is just a place for some to get fixated on numbers with multiple threads as if somehow that will make the old dead version come back.

It won't be the first game to fail and it won't be the last, I've seen many games bite the dust along with my investment in them....but that's life, it's not all sun and fun.


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CheefCoach #3 Posted 04 May 2018 - 06:01 PM

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Main problem of 1.9 was bad graphic. And bad sound. It didn't improve with 2.0. Developer don't have enough knowledge to create proper game for year (now) 2018. 

Second problem was, and probably stile is War Thunder. It come before WoWp and dragged almost entire market. Most people like realism, and don't like arcades, and that is what WT gives them. 

Another problem was how many people are capable to learn and understand 3D game.

Also lack of advertisement didn't help either. 

That is what led to low server population. 

 

What 2.0 did improve is how easy is to fly the actual plane. For average player, average newcomer, 2.0 is better version of the game. 

 

Bots on both teams are roughly a same. It is humans that decide who will win. It doesn't always come to how have more points, or who made more kills. Tactical decisions aren't so easy to quantify. 

 


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Horcan #4 Posted 04 May 2018 - 06:10 PM

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In 1.9 l33t bashed noobs and win, who frustrated and left, because it was just fly/die/fly/die.

In 2.0 l33t bash noobs and sometimes still lose, but noobs at least have something to do fighting bots and neutral planes, respawn and go try again, not waste time over and over with garage and prebattle after each death.

I dont believe 2.0 is a great game, but its better than 1.9 gameplay wise. Yes, game mechanics are retarded, but its still better than mindless Bnz/TnB in the middle of the map.

Get over it or simply leave like those you say left already. Its 2.0 or they shut the game down. You are starting to be pathetic with topic after topic.



bug #5 Posted 04 May 2018 - 06:18 PM

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It always was quite arcade, its even more so now. Also, military base and command center randomly distributed on maps makes it much worse. Many games you know who wins just by telling who go one of those bases closest their spawn, making game very boring. Maybe if average number of players was more than 2 on each team it helped, but I think not.

Edited by bug, 04 May 2018 - 06:18 PM.


CheefCoach #6 Posted 04 May 2018 - 06:38 PM

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World of tanks have many more players than World of Warplanes, of witch many loses more often than wins, and never bother to learn the game. So winning and learning aren't important. And everybody is complaining about teams, and everybody, and still come every day for more. 

But game is fun, easy to play, and good looking to eye. 


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dreambill #7 Posted 04 May 2018 - 07:20 PM

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View PostCheefCoach, on 04 May 2018 - 06:38 PM, said:

But game is fun, easy to play, and good looking to eye. 

 

For the first I have a completely different opinion.

For the second I agree, in fact is for 4 year old kids.

For the third I'll pass. It's neither gorgeous nor bad.

But I still believe the only solution would be merging good elements from both games, and then improve.

All the move so far (Deleting V1.9 and bringing V2.0 so awfully poor designed, with TONS of problems) proved that WG made it (once again) WRONG.

And since I liked more the old version It makes me sad to see the sacrifice of it, leading to a game with half the population allready, (The problem that V2.0 supposed to fix)



CheefCoach #8 Posted 04 May 2018 - 07:46 PM

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,,But game is fun, easy to play, and good looking to eye. " When I wrote this, I was talking about World of Tanks. 
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Dr_Ar_MG #9 Posted 04 May 2018 - 10:25 PM

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View PostCheefCoach, on 04 May 2018 - 06:01 PM, said:

Main problem of 1.9 was bad graphic. And bad sound. It didn't improve with 2.0. Developer don't have enough knowledge to create proper game for year (now) 2018. 

Second problem was, and probably stile is War Thunder. It come before WoWp and dragged almost entire market. Most people like realism, and don't like arcades, and that is what WT gives them. 

Another problem was how many people are capable to learn and understand 3D game.

Also lack of advertisement didn't help either. 

That is what led to low server population.

Cheef..my friend I have to be disagree with you .:(

the graphics could be a problem but never can't be the main problem of a game..graphics has two parts, quality and performance.

about quality, it can't be a problem... many new  popular games with low quality and bad visual things. and about performance (fps), the performance of 2.0 is worse than 1.9. lower FPS. anyway none of them can't be the MAIN problem.

Block Quote

What 2.0 did improve is how easy is to fly the actual plane. For average player, average newcomer, 2.0 is better version of the game.

 about fighters yes, but heavy fighters and ground attackers ...are you sure ?

Block Quote

 Bots on both teams are roughly a same. It is humans that decide who will win. It doesn't always come to how have more points, or who made more kills. Tactical decisions aren't so easy to quantify. 

 yes bots are same, but in 2.0 more bots by number and they are more effective on the results. in 1.9 you could win without good bots but in 2.0 it's not possible (too hard)

there are many example in other topic (unfair battles), proves that it's wrong. some battles 1 vs 1 human. one side +14000 points +3 captured sectors against -5000 but defeats. some times 9 bots with an afk guy can defeat a good team.

 

Block Quote

 World of tanks have many more players than World of Warplanes, of witch many loses more often than wins, and never bother to learn the game. So winning and learning aren't important. And everybody is complaining about teams, and everybody, and still come every day for more.

all airplane games are less popular than games on the grounds. it's hard for many people to play such game. in world of tank the brain processes x,y but in airplane games x,y,z. it's completely worng to compare WOWP with WOT, the only true comparison is between 1.9 and 2.0.

 


Edited by Dr_Ar_MG, 04 May 2018 - 10:32 PM.


Dr_Ar_MG #10 Posted 04 May 2018 - 10:38 PM

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View PostHorcan, on 04 May 2018 - 06:10 PM, said:

In 1.9 l33t bashed noobs and win, who frustrated and left, because it was just fly/die/fly/die.

In 2.0 l33t bash noobs and sometimes still lose, but noobs at least have something to do fighting bots and neutral planes, respawn and go try again, not waste time over and over with garage and prebattle after each death.

I dont believe 2.0 is a great game, but its better than 1.9 gameplay wise. Yes, game mechanics are retarded, but its still better than mindless Bnz/TnB in the middle of the map.

Get over it or simply leave like those you say left already. Its 2.0 or they shut the game down. You are starting to be pathetic with topic after topic.

please read this

 

and this one please



CheefCoach #11 Posted 04 May 2018 - 10:43 PM

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I think it is easier for all classes in 2.0. In 1.x it was confusing where is mouse pointer, and where is aiming cross, that was following mouse with delay. I didn't find that difficult, but I have cousin who couldn't get it. He had no problems getting WoT right away. So flying with attack plane is easier. Getting results that will give you token; that is much harder in 2.0. 

Generally, it was easier to get tokens in 1.9. But it made game much more frustrating. Specially those kill 3 and survive missions. But that doesn't make game better and worse; game is for fun, and not for tokens farming. 

In early days there were different bots on both teams, but in 1.9 bots were same on both sides. 

And I did write down that it is not all in points. Player A can have 14 k of points by shooting down more planes but during taking insignificance sectors. Player B can have more assists, because worse aiming, or worse plane, or worse lag, but it can take key sectors at key time. If they are only A and B. And 9 bots can't beat good team of humans. And when I say team, that include all human players. One great player and couple of terrible ones is still worse than several average ones. If you want to prove me wrong, you will have to post full length battles. I can't analyze just based on result screens. 


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BravelyRanAway #12 Posted 04 May 2018 - 11:16 PM

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View PostDr_Ar_MG, on 04 May 2018 - 10:25 PM, said:

all airplane games are less popular than games on the grounds. it's hard for many people to play such game. in world of tank the brain processes x,y but in airplane games x,y,z. it's completely worng to compare WOWP with WOT, the only true comparison is between 1.9 and 2.0.

 

WoT and WoWS's suits the casual player much more than WoWP's. 15 minutes of minimal movement in WoT or WoWS's can yield results....WoT camp in bush and use mouse to turn turret and shoot.....camp out of range in WoWS's and try hit what ever gets lit. Not so in WoWP's....WASD is vital, concentration is vital....there is no sitting in a bush spewing hate chat, that's why there is little abuse or chat in WoWP's, you're too busy using WASD and shooting others to have the time. In effect WoWP's is not as relaxing/slow as WoT or WoWS's, so wallet whales are less likely to stick with it or invest.


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CheefCoach #13 Posted 04 May 2018 - 11:39 PM

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View PostDr_Ar_MG, on 04 May 2018 - 11:38 PM, said:

 

Don't have time to read more than 60 pages of complaining. Game was changed. It was fun before, and it is fun now as well. 

 

Block Quote

 all airplane games are less popular than games on the grounds. it's hard for many people to play such game. in world of tank the brain processes x,y but in airplane games x,y,z. it's completely worng to compare WOWP with WOT, the only true comparison is between 1.9 and 2.0.

 

Of course you can compare them. They are both on-line multiple war games, and emotions are similar. Also you can add War Thunder as compartment. 


Edited by CheefCoach, 04 May 2018 - 11:43 PM.

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CheefCoach #14 Posted 04 May 2018 - 11:49 PM

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View PostBravelyRanAway, on 05 May 2018 - 12:16 AM, said:

WoT and WoWS's suits the casual player much more than WoWP's. 15 minutes of minimal movement in WoT or WoWS's can yield results....WoT camp in bush and use mouse to turn turret and shoot.....camp out of range in WoWS's and try hit what ever gets lit. Not so in WoWP's....WASD is vital, concentration is vital....there is no sitting in a bush spewing hate chat, that's why there is little abuse or chat in WoWP's, you're too busy using WASD and shooting others to have the time. In effect WoWP's is not as relaxing/slow as WoT or WoWS's, so wallet whales are less likely to stick with it or invest.

 

This simply isn't true. Passively playing WoT or WoWs won't give you results, and in WoWp you can go very high and be passive as well. 

Playing (meaning playing with quality) World of Warplanes is far more easier than playing WoT or WoWs. 


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Dr_Ar_MG #15 Posted 05 May 2018 - 06:25 AM

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View PostBravelyRanAway, on 04 May 2018 - 11:16 PM, said:

WoT and WoWS's suits the casual player much more than WoWP's. 15 minutes of minimal movement in WoT or WoWS's can yield results....WoT camp in bush and use mouse to turn turret and shoot.....camp out of range in WoWS's and try hit what ever gets lit. Not so in WoWP's....WASD is vital, concentration is vital....there is no sitting in a bush spewing hate chat, that's why there is little abuse or chat in WoWP's, you're too busy using WASD and shooting others to have the time. In effect WoWP's is not as relaxing/slow as WoT or WoWS's, so wallet whales are less likely to stick with it or invest.

 

honestly havn't played WOT and WOSh...I don't like ships and tanks... just planes and helicopters. but I know the airplane games are less popular than other games.

Horcan #16 Posted 05 May 2018 - 08:49 AM

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I wont read 60 pages of "i beg of you revert to 1.9" because i didint liked 1.9 more than 2.0. I got used to difference in controlls after 1000 games and that is no longer an issue, since im not a real life pilot and i cant tell which is realistic and which is arcade. As i said i see 2.0 as an improvement because it removed most of the dead times with time in hangar, prebattle, flight to middle map, where you sometimes died in two seconds and restarted the process, leading to frustration if it happened too often.Now you have some activity on your way to meeting the real enemy ( even if most of it its bots ), even the game require some decisions, like which base to go or which plane is most dangerous or which would be more important to kill, to spend 2 minutes climbing for a bomber or killing 3 fighters instead. Its not just mindless dogfighting in the middle of the map ( you can get your 1.9 fans and do that in training rooms ), and even if you die, you respawn instead of another 5 minutes of wasted time.

The reason for 2.0 failing as i see it is bad implementation, bugs, rigged games ( i think everyone agree that we cant have this game without the bots because there is not enough human population and it will never be , but bots presence shouldnt have such impact as to decide which side will win , like those games where a human totally own but still lose because of bots ), almost totally failed events ( boring like the one with sides, or not enough tested and with impossible missions like westfall ), bad desing of the maps ( unbalanced, some that are won on the firest two minutes, like that one for low tiers where if you win the middle airport you basically win the map since all the enemy team respawn again in the corner and takes too long to get back )and not the fact that it evolved from 1.9.

YOu are right about the fact that you cant compare this to WoT. Half of WoT population cant control a rock with 4 keys and mouse to put it in a bush and shoot at things, i cant imagine those apes spiraling a plane at 500 kmh on 3 axes and at the same time shoot at another spinning target and also have a clue where the hell that thing behind you shooting at you is.

 


Edited by Horcan, 05 May 2018 - 09:00 AM.


jakub_czyli_ja #17 Posted 05 May 2018 - 09:12 AM

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View PostBravelyRanAway, on 04 May 2018 - 05:58 PM, said:

Best just to shut down the game altogether. There wasn't enough after many years to financially support 1.9 and that wasn't going to change with 2.0 because the WoWP's name is too jaded and tarnished. There are too few devs working on this new game version to bring it up to scratch and it has so many bugs that'll drive new players away before they even get to learn the game. Then they can shut down the forum as well which is just a place for some to get fixated on numbers with multiple threads as if somehow that will make the old dead version come back.

It won't be the first game to fail and it won't be the last, I've seen many games bite the dust along with my investment in them....but that's life, it's not all sun and fun.

No. To make it simple and player-centric.

1.9 was not simple, because there were easy targets - GT and hard targets - planes, so a lot of noobs and newbies chose easy targets (even with brick level bots), and got shot down because they also became easy targets, or crashed because they wanted to finish off the GT before breaking off.

So solution would be easy - remove GT from early stages, where new players learn.

 

Instead of that, WG decided to implement poor man's skill based MM - newbie protection (which also shows, that WG can do various things with MM).

This of course didn't work, because new players hit the skill wall not at tier I, but when protection wore off.

Solution for that would be to apply full skill based MM - those who learn play with those who learn, and with adjusted bots, those who don't - don't, they should be able to play the game all the way to tier X against flying bricks and flying pianos, as long as they pay and it pleases them.

 

Difference should happen with the endgame, where all players should met, and those skillful enough should be rewarded.

 

Plus some additional tweaks, like no flights (team mode instead), no frag for ram (because it turned out to be the only way to score marks on plane for a lot of players).

 

Reatrded MM (like one plane of tier +1 and rest one tier lower) - flat one, or at worse 5/10. A small step had been made, apparently there is no +2 now in WoWP.

 

But no.

Skill based MM is tabu, can't be done because fcuk off.

GTs can't be removed, because? Probably because legends about IIWW - Russia vs The Evil Empire, low level fights, IL The Wonder Plane 2 and such bullshit.

Frag for ram - the same, brave Motherland defenders who after shooting out all their ammo, they rammed Nazi bombers bringing death to their wifes and children, blah blah blah.

Matchmaker - also some bullshit coming from WoT - the most retarded I've read is "If no +2 MM, then T-34 won't be able to meet the Tiger". Which in WoT ends with tier IV tanks meeting tiers VI, who take it with 2 shots. Much more often than being tier VI tank and meeting tier IV and taking them out with 2 shots. Simply because of math.

 

Devs have nothing to do. This game needs a man who will made a manly decisions, and will stop treating players like spoiled brats who need to be able to kill all enemy team (be that +1 plane), because to make that available, a number of other players becomes frustrated.

Instead design whole game to fit also those, who seek entertainment, as well as those who seek challenge. And separate them.

 

View PostBravelyRanAway, on 04 May 2018 - 11:16 PM, said:

WoT and WoWS's suits the casual player much more than WoWP's. 15 minutes of minimal movement in WoT or WoWS's can yield results....WoT camp in bush and use mouse to turn turret and shoot.....camp out of range in WoWS's and try hit what ever gets lit. Not so in WoWP's....WASD is vital, concentration is vital....there is no sitting in a bush spewing hate chat, that's why there is little abuse or chat in WoWP's, you're too busy using WASD and shooting others to have the time. In effect WoWP's is not as relaxing/slow as WoT or WoWS's, so wallet whales are less likely to stick with it or invest.

Because the game is made so.

Skill based MM, no skilled players and bots above brick level, and more passive play available.

But no, because some ideological $hit.


Edited by jakub_czyli_ja, 05 May 2018 - 09:24 AM.

Clear cache/Skasuj cache: cmd /K del /Q /F /S "%TEMP%\wargaming.net\wowp\cache"

 

And everything else/i wszystko inne: cmd /K del /Q /F /S "%APPDATA%\Wargaming.net\World of Warplanes"


jakub_czyli_ja #18 Posted 05 May 2018 - 09:21 AM

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View PostCheefCoach, on 04 May 2018 - 06:38 PM, said:

But game is fun, easy to play, and good looking to eye. 

No, it isn't.

It isn't easy to play.

 

Watch this, how much time he is confused:

 

It;s not easy to play, because it's hard to figure, how to play and what to do to win (there are a lot of tubes "I dunno what I'm doin, but there are a lot of explosions, so it's fun").


Clear cache/Skasuj cache: cmd /K del /Q /F /S "%TEMP%\wargaming.net\wowp\cache"

 

And everything else/i wszystko inne: cmd /K del /Q /F /S "%APPDATA%\Wargaming.net\World of Warplanes"


BravelyRanAway #19 Posted 05 May 2018 - 09:23 AM

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View PostCheefCoach, on 04 May 2018 - 11:49 PM, said:

 

This simply isn't true. Passively playing WoT or WoWs won't give you results, and in WoWp you can go very high and be passive as well. 

Playing (meaning playing with quality) World of Warplanes is far more easier than playing WoT or WoWs. 

 

You misunderstand....players can and do sit in a bush/camp base or redline snipe and hit stuff and they believe they are contributing or they can play arty ans just sit and click. These things cannot be done in WoWP's.

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BravelyRanAway #20 Posted 05 May 2018 - 09:26 AM

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View Postjakub_czyli_ja, on 05 May 2018 - 09:21 AM, said:

No, it isn't.

It isn't easy to play.

 

Watch this, how much time he is confused:

 

 

It;s not easy to play, because it's hard to figure, how to play and what to do to win (there are a lot of tubes "I dunno what I'm doin, but there are a lot of explosions, so it's fun").

Even I knew he was referring to WoT not WoWP's....he even explained that in his next post.


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