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blackmoomba #61 Posted 14 July 2018 - 09:56 PM

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First of all, as Eekee said... a replay could explain a lot. I don't really want a replay, but it's like vital to know what map was on... what type of bases were on it. Having this info, i, as a player can formulate a plan of attack/defense... what are my primary objectives, what to contest and were can i intercept my enemy.

 

I had a game a few weeks ago, in an IL40. Won it with like 10k PP while the enemy scored 14k. Map was the water-island one with the airfield in the middle, the variant with 2 military bases and 2 garrisons. Had a very bad start, afk and having to backtrack to the military base that was being already contested by enemy bots... lost a lot of time flipping that, however the points situation was not that bad, about 120 points behind when the squall was about to hit. I knew he was low hp and was tracking his position on the minimap. I flipped a garrison across the map and immediately ditch it just before the squall, respawned in 15-20 sec, nailed the human and flipped back the military base he capped. At that point the time, points and caps were in his favor... my military base started attacking the field, his had nothing to bombard, i went for another garrison, and after that for his military base. Won the game in a similar points situation... 800 to 780ish, 4 to 1 caps. It wasn't the only game that i won that close, that way or by using other tactics.

 

Problem is some times, even the most experienced players or, as some1 said before, especially the 0.x-1.x vets feel the need to kill/destroy and lack focus of the win conditions... i can't stress enough how many times this happens, and it usually happens with the same players. I'm not saying my way of playing is 100% guaranteed win, sometimes even i lose track of the objectives or have pure bad luck and stumble across 1 heavy and 1 multirole just when i enter a base... and getting shredded to pieces, SH!T HAPPENS.

 

PS: thanks if you had the patience to read my "tactics" and maybe understood it


Edited by blackmoomba, 14 July 2018 - 09:58 PM.


zen_monk_ #62 Posted 14 July 2018 - 10:27 PM

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dreambill #63 Posted 15 July 2018 - 11:19 PM

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View Postblackmoomba, on 14 July 2018 - 09:56 PM, said:

First of all, as Eekee said... a replay could explain a lot. I don't really want a replay, but it's like vital to know what map was on... what type of bases were on it. Having this info, i, as a player can formulate a plan of attack/defense... what are my primary objectives, what to contest and were can i intercept my enemy.

 

I had a game a few weeks ago, in an IL40. Won it with like 10k PP while the enemy scored 14k. Map was the water-island one with the airfield in the middle, the variant with 2 military bases and 2 garrisons. Had a very bad start, afk and having to backtrack to the military base that was being already contested by enemy bots... lost a lot of time flipping that, however the points situation was not that bad, about 120 points behind when the squall was about to hit. I knew he was low hp and was tracking his position on the minimap. I flipped a garrison across the map and immediately ditch it just before the squall, respawned in 15-20 sec, nailed the human and flipped back the military base he capped. At that point the time, points and caps were in his favor... my military base started attacking the field, his had nothing to bombard, i went for another garrison, and after that for his military base. Won the game in a similar points situation... 800 to 780ish, 4 to 1 caps. It wasn't the only game that i won that close, that way or by using other tactics.

 

Problem is some times, even the most experienced players or, as some1 said before, especially the 0.x-1.x vets feel the need to kill/destroy and lack focus of the win conditions... i can't stress enough how many times this happens, and it usually happens with the same players. I'm not saying my way of playing is 100% guaranteed win, sometimes even i lose track of the objectives or have pure bad luck and stumble across 1 heavy and 1 multirole just when i enter a base... and getting shredded to pieces, SH!T HAPPENS.

 

PS: thanks if you had the patience to read my "tactics" and maybe understood it

 

I again, whenever I play I cannot persuade my self that "correct" tactics (what ever these can be) have to do anything with the result of a battle.

The result is always irrelevant to my try. There too many things mixing up as time and place to be done, that is impossible to evaluate and be there and execute them for sure.

Its pure luck, like calibration, and this is annoying and not entertaining, win or loose to me.

I have battles were I ignore all planing for (lets say) a mission which end up as wins ???, While others that I try to participate and execute objectives which are crushing defeats.

Also perhaps my (silly) feeling is that are battles were all my bullets never register any hit to my targets even if its a fat GA at zero range, while in others whenever I press my trigger all enemy planes are obliterating at once.

Luck (even regarding the behavior of bots - neutral or team) has the major role to the result and this has ruined any joy in playing this game.


Edited by dreambill, 15 July 2018 - 11:22 PM.


Grumpy_Guts #64 Posted 15 July 2018 - 11:24 PM

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Amen, Brother !!!

zen_monk_ #65 Posted 16 July 2018 - 05:42 AM

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View Postdreambill, on 15 July 2018 - 11:19 PM, said:

 

Also perhaps my (silly) feeling is that are battles were all my bullets never register any hit to my targets even if its a fat GA at zero range, while in others whenever I press my trigger all enemy planes are obliterating at once.

 

 

Exactly this is the way WG ensures "...when the player has been repeatedly put into too many easy battles, the balancing is done in favor of harder battle sessions, thereby keeping the player challenged instead of letting the player become bored with easy games..." as they state in the patent of the game.

 

It is not your silly feeling, that's the way MM works. MM is literally what it says, Match Making (the making of the outcome of the match), not just arranging teams per tiers and class. It is the part when the + and - variables of weapon performance come into play. For your entire team, and the opponents.

 

 



Spuggy #66 Posted 16 July 2018 - 06:05 AM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 16 July 2018 - 05:42 AM, said:

 

Exactly this is the way WG ensures "...when the player has been repeatedly put into too many easy battles, the balancing is done in favor of harder battle sessions, thereby keeping the player challenged instead of letting the player become bored with easy games..." as they state in the patent of the game.

 

It is not your silly feeling, that's the way MM works. MM is literally what it says, Match Making (the making of the outcome of the match), not just arranging teams per tiers and class. It is the part when the + and - variables of weapon performance come into play. For your entire team, and the opponents.

 

 

 

 Much??



zen_monk_ #67 Posted 16 July 2018 - 06:19 AM

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...and that's exactly the reaction which prevents any serious analysis. Of something we all felt.

 

Mate, that's what they say. In their patent. All the explanation you need on strange win/loss rows, erratic/perfect aiming etc.


Edited by zen_monk_, 16 July 2018 - 06:21 AM.


Jonagus #68 Posted 16 July 2018 - 05:37 PM

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After the game was over and after "What the ...." I was about to call names to my team, and put the blame on it, I went to the table of results and found that any member on my team win to the players in the other team . Human to human, bot to bot, every member of my team, ALL OF THEN were winners, but actually lose the game .... make no sense to me.

 

Jonagus.


Edited by Jonagus, 16 July 2018 - 05:38 PM.

Jonagus


Spuggy #69 Posted 16 July 2018 - 08:24 PM

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View PostJonagus, on 16 July 2018 - 05:37 PM, said:

After the game was over and after "What the ...." I was about to call names to my team, and put the blame on it, I went to the table of results and found that any member on my team win to the players in the other team . Human to human, bot to bot, every member of my team, ALL OF THEN were winners, but actually lose the game .... make no sense to me.

 

Jonagus.

 

You do realise that it is possible to pad your personal points score without actually adding to the match effort, right?

 

I do it all the time on matches I can see going in our favour.



Jonagus #70 Posted 18 July 2018 - 04:15 PM

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View PostSpuggy, on 16 July 2018 - 08:24 PM, said:

 

You do realise that it is possible to pad your personal points score without actually adding to the match effort, right?

 

I do it all the time on matches I can see going in our favour.

 

I Do !!! But do you realise I got the "Flying Revenge" and "Hero of the sky" Badges, awarded literally by "Maximun effectiveness in fullfilling the aircraft type specific mission" and the "highest aircraft type grade" but not only I did a piece of art battle everyone in my team did at least better that the enemy but they win and we lose. This is crazy, stupid, boring and dont make any sense in version 1.9 it was clear when you win and when you lose. Now is a mistery only understood by players like you, so smart, so intelligent, so ...... and so .......

Make us a favor and check the figures I do play 2000 games more that you did, but you still consider yourself so clever to tell me: I did not add to the match effort, not like you, that you did every macht.

Congratulations Spuggy selfconfidence it is not a problem to you !!! Please, Grow up little boy and dont insult veterans every time you open your mouth, please ...

 

Jonagus.


Edited by Jonagus, 18 July 2018 - 04:24 PM.

Jonagus


zen_monk_ #71 Posted 18 July 2018 - 04:30 PM

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View PostJonagus, on 18 July 2018 - 04:15 PM, said:

 

I Do !!! But do you realise I got the "Flying Revenge" and "Hero of the sky" Badges, awarded literally by "Maximun effectiveness in fullfilling the aircraft type specific mission" and the "highest aircraft type grade" but not only I did a piece of art battle everyone in my team did at least better that the enemy but they win and we lose.

 

Jonagus.

 

And this, exactly this is why the "victory only" requirement should be changed. So far the best suggestion was "first three from the losing team, last three from the winning..."

 

Man, I feel your pain. Been there on many many occasions. The frustration is almost a deal breaker.

 

A lot of it (not all if you care about W/L%) will be gone if you gain in a loss the same as if you have won - if you performed brilliantly. There's nothing wrong there, and a huge amount of frustration would be instantly removed.

 

We must be realistic in what we ask. For the Devs, to change the entire mechanism of the game to prevent yours/mine situation is a tall order. Complicated. This "first three, last three" (hell, even "the one first-the one last") is much easier to implement - they've done so in their other games - and would bring a whole different atmosphere with much less frustration.

 

Please tell honestly: would you felt better if in the game you've described you had all the benefits as if you had won? (except the WL% of course, but we can't have it all)



dreambill #72 Posted 18 July 2018 - 04:45 PM

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I support the best / last 3 even if this means that with games with 2 - 4 humans each side (as for now), almost every decent player will be rewarded regardless winning or loosing.

Better scoring from bots is very easy in conquest.

This move can put some relief to players but doesn't solve the fact that the game as it is, is not well designed and has major flaws, which make it no fun to play (at least for me)



zen_monk_ #73 Posted 18 July 2018 - 04:59 PM

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View Postdreambill, on 18 July 2018 - 04:45 PM, said:

I support the best / last 3 even if this means that with games with 2 - 4 humans each side (as for now), almost every decent player will be rewarded regardless winning or loosing.

 

And there's nothing wrong with that. AFKers will be below, no gain there. He who made an effort should be rewarded. And it would be a huge relief!
 

We must ask for what can be delivered.

 

 



zgubny #74 Posted 19 July 2018 - 04:02 PM

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View PostJonagus, on 18 July 2018 - 05:15 PM, said:

 do you realise I got the "Flying Revenge" and "Hero of the sky" Badges, awarded literally by "Maximun effectiveness in fullfilling the aircraft type specific mission" and the "highest aircraft type grade" but not only I did a piece of art battle everyone in my team did at least better that the enemy but they win and we lose. This is crazy, stupid, boring and dont make any sense in version 1.9 it was clear when you win and when you lose.

 

exactly and we had so much fun playing like this ......

zeitza #75 Posted Yesterday, 09:43 AM

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You should ask this guy for a replay..he clearly doesn't know how to play this game... There is nothing wrong with the game and the balance/bots ...for sure

 

 

 



chief_de_wrecker #76 Posted Yesterday, 01:39 PM

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View Postzeitza, on 21 July 2018 - 09:43 AM, said:

You should ask this guy for a replay..he clearly doesn't know how to play this game... There is nothing wrong with the game and the balance/bots ...for sure

If there is nothing wrong with the game, then there is something about awarding points....






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