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CheefCoach #21 Posted 11 July 2018 - 10:41 PM

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View PostHorcan, on 11 July 2018 - 10:22 PM, said:

That is exactly my point. If i stayed in a single sector , raping bots over and over , while the enemy human did absolutely nothing, being afk. Yet, even if i killed 20k worth of point enemy bots, they were more proficient at capturing the other 4 bases than my entire team of bots which were unhindered by a human? And you want me to accept it isnt rigged?

 

It isn't rigged. But it is strange, and I would like to see the replay. 

And it is your foul for loss as well, because you could go and capture few more sectors. 


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Horcan #22 Posted 11 July 2018 - 10:52 PM

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View PostCheefCoach, on 11 July 2018 - 11:41 PM, said:

 

It isn't rigged. But it is strange, and I would like to see the replay. 

And it is your foul for loss as well, because you could go and capture few more sectors. 

 

You still miss my point. It isnt about a certain replay or game, like others said its plenty of those games. If i stay in middle sector, enemy bots pouring continuously on me , i keep killing them ( the 20k points ) so half of enemy bots are also busy  on the same sector as me. Yet the entire rest of my team is incapable of handling the other half of enemy bots to get the other bases and you tell me it isnt rigged and the bots are same skill?

zen_monk_ #23 Posted 11 July 2018 - 10:53 PM

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View PostBiBaBummsebiene, on 11 July 2018 - 10:07 PM, said:

My point was: to get more ppl you need an attractive playerbase which currently simply is non existing (Or at least only partly). To enhance numbers get a second mode like the „hardcore mode“. This will attract older players to come back -> bigger playerbase (still not more money but the more ppl play the more attractive for new players...).

 

I vehemently disagree.

 

The bane of 1.x (at least the first half of it) were exactly those older players. In HF wings of three. In hardcore mode.

 

I personally know at least 20-30 people from the old WoT clan who came, spent a couple of weeks, a month and left saying: "What's the point? If you have their wing in your team you'll win but with zero points cause they will kill all, and if they are enemies they'll kill you and then you stare at the monitor".

 

If this game had respawn from the start, everything would have been different.

 



Horcan #24 Posted 11 July 2018 - 10:56 PM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 11 July 2018 - 11:53 PM, said:

 

I vehemently disagree.

 

The bane of 1.x (at least the first half of it) were exactly those older players. In HF wings of three. In hardcore mode.

 

I personally know at least 20-30 people from the old WoT clan who came, spent a couple of weeks, a month and left saying: "What's the point? If you have their wing in your team you'll win but with zero points cause they will kill all, and if they are enemies they'll kill you and then you stare at the monitor".

 

If this game had respawn from the start, everything would have been different.

 

 

Exactly what i always said. Thats why i would never touch again a deathmatch type game mode. You either play an OP plane or waste your time. In respawn i can even play Pegasus and still be usefull and have a little fun.

Edited by Horcan, 11 July 2018 - 10:57 PM.


chief_de_wrecker #25 Posted 12 July 2018 - 12:08 AM

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View Posteekeeboo, on 11 July 2018 - 03:08 PM, said:

Without a replay to give you more details, the game is more than just scoring a lot of points, it's about scoring them in the right places. But that's just a suspicion as you get a lot of points for killing more small targets or lots of GT in a zone without capping. But the slower you cap the worse it is for your team. 

 

Exactly..... Why is the game designed to be played in certain sectors? Why can't the players use the complete extent of a map to suit the play style?... This design really cramps...

Edited by chief_de_wrecker, 12 July 2018 - 12:09 AM.


Grumpy_Guts #26 Posted 12 July 2018 - 01:33 AM

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Re spawn has a lot in its favour but in fighters you are back in action from the off, what is frustrating is you get a new shiny full health GAA with no bombs/rockets and are a sitting duck or twiddling about till they activate, most of the time when you are needed to swing balance back to your side.

    



BiBaBummsebiene #27 Posted 12 July 2018 - 03:14 PM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 11 July 2018 - 10:53 PM, said:

 

I vehemently disagree.

 

The bane of 1.x (at least the first half of it) were exactly those older players. In HF wings of three. In hardcore mode.

 

I personally know at least 20-30 people from the old WoT clan who came, spent a couple of weeks, a month and left saying: "What's the point? If you have their wing in your team you'll win but with zero points cause they will kill all, and if they are enemies they'll kill you and then you stare at the monitor".

 

If this game had respawn from the start, everything would have been different.

 

Again you missunderstand me. I am with you that in this mode wings of 3 or wings at all are way too dangerous. So you made up a point I wasn‘t even refering too. It’s all about the >>mode<< NOTHING else of 1.X (I don’t want back 0.X or 1.X). Absolutly nothing but 15 vs 15 without respawn and without capturing. Simply find and destroy. That‘s all these „complain“ posts are all about. The current mode doesn’t make every action count. The current mode is for those who really want to learn. The other mode is fast and simple. For the „just jump in and have some fun“-players. Those between pro and noob ;) That‘s all I am caring here. Give those players a playground.

 

And zen: you still can do this as conquest with respawn will still exist next to tdm. OP planes even exist in conquest. I had a lot of fun in the Beaufighter in 1.X and that plane was never OP.

 

There is simply no reason why we can‘t have a second game mode next to conquest. Even the „we split the playerbase“ is wrong as each mode will attract it’s own fans. The lovers of the old version will come back and play „their“ loved mode and every other can play conquest. Better this way then losing gamers cause they think WG isn’t caring about them.

 

greetings,

BiBa


Edited by BiBaBummsebiene, 12 July 2018 - 03:28 PM.

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zen_monk_ #28 Posted 12 July 2018 - 03:25 PM

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15 vs 15 is waaay too ambitious. 5 vs 5 is more realistic. But anyways, this Deatmatch option wouldn't hurt. (would be less dangerous players in a normal gameplay :-) In there, no bots no caps no nothing.

 

I've proposed something very similar a wile back, a bit different so you can include GA and Bombers

 

View Postzen_monk_, on 28 June 2018 - 09:14 AM, said:

For starters, it should be very simple. PvP, no bots, no white planes, no respawns. Each side owns one factory each, owned form the start. Factory doesn't generate any points, nothing, only exist to be capped/defended.

 

Teams are formed either of Clans or Clans+volunteers, max 5 vs 5. Can be 1 vs 5 if 1 so wishes.

 

The team who caps enemy base or kill all enemy planes (whichever comes first) wins.



BiBaBummsebiene #29 Posted 12 July 2018 - 03:35 PM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 12 July 2018 - 03:25 PM, said:

15 vs 15 is waaay too ambitious. 5 vs 5 is more realistic. But anyways, this Deatmatch option wouldn't hurt. (would be less dangerous players in a normal gameplay :-) In there, no bots no caps no nothing.

 

I've proposed something very similar a wile back, a bit different so you can include GA and Bombers

 

5v5 you get dumped too fast by good players, that’s why I said 15v15. Bots can still be there. They don’t have to be very strong. Make them all „soldiers“ and that’s ok. Much more interesting would be the „point-system“ for winning, so GAAs and bombers have a good impact. 1.9 was on a good way (in balancing points for kills of planes and gts), but wings of heavys were too strong. No wings at all in this mode would be a step in the right direction. As there is already a new altitude energy system the OP heavys wouldn’t exist anyways now (I guess; has to be tested)


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zen_monk_ #30 Posted 12 July 2018 - 03:44 PM

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Now wait, wasn't the whole idea "no bots, no respawns"?

dreambill #31 Posted 12 July 2018 - 05:51 PM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 12 July 2018 - 03:44 PM, said:

Now wait, wasn't the whole idea "no bots, no respawns"?

 

No neutral and defense bots, no respawns.

Standard team filling bots are nessesery to fill 15 places per side

 



View PostHorcan, on 11 July 2018 - 10:33 PM, said:

I really dont see how making a game mode for hardcore players would bring more people to the game. New players will obviously choose the easier mode, and taking the veterans from the conquest mode will reduce the population rather than increasing it. So instead of a dying game, you will have two dead ones.

 

You may surprised how many people wait for this mode without playing till now.

In my 30 active people clan in v1.9, only 1 is playing full conquest, 4 more (including me) have a few battles in it (without liking it) and 20 more are asking from time to time if this "hardcore" mode appeared, to return.

So there be definitely new (old) players for this mode and no great reduction from conquest.




Edited by Daxeno, 19 July 2018 - 09:14 AM.


CheefCoach #32 Posted 12 July 2018 - 06:54 PM

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In 15 vs 15 also get dumped very fast, but there is much longer climbing time. 

 

Having several modes would split this small population even more. Not a solution. 

 

Player who like world of warplanes will like any version of it. Player who like to complain will always find some reason to do so. 


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dreambill #33 Posted 12 July 2018 - 07:13 PM

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View PostCheefCoach, on 12 July 2018 - 06:54 PM, said

Player who like world of warplanes will like any version of it. Player who like to complain will always find some reason to do so. 

 

Allow me to have a different opinion on this. I don't love at all conquest. I liked V1.9 and staying only in the hope of conquest evolving to something a lot closer to V1.9 (even as a secondary mode)

And for sure no money from me till then.



Horcan #34 Posted 12 July 2018 - 11:01 PM

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You forget how small dev team is. I doubt they have enough people to develop two modes at the same time.

jss78 #35 Posted 12 July 2018 - 11:36 PM

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Yeah, it's really about doing those points at the right places, and at right times. Conversely, it's possible to farm lots of points in this game in places where it doesn't really contribute much.

 

Also, sometimes even if you go to right places, you just end up spending a lot of time just short of finishing a cap. You do the right thing, and do it well, but fall just short of the threshold where you get the points (=capping).

 

I do expect that if you took a correlation between your points and chance of winning, it'd be strong. You can improve your chances to win, but not guarantee it.

 

As far as those remaining losses, I'd just take comfort in the words of old Jean-Luc:

 



Spuggy #36 Posted 13 July 2018 - 05:41 AM

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@jss78. Your meme is the perfect answer to this thread. You win the internet today



BiBaBummsebiene #37 Posted 13 July 2018 - 08:27 AM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 12 July 2018 - 03:44 PM, said:

Now wait, wasn't the whole idea "no bots, no respawns"?

 

 
No, as Dreambill said: it‘s about a mode: TDM, no respawn, no refill, no conquering. Those who love conquest can still play it without any further aspects. It’s about giving a part of the community their beloved mode. (-> less whine threats + more satisfied faces)
 

View PostCheefCoach, on 12 July 2018 - 06:54 PM, said:

In 15 vs 15 also get dumped very fast, but there is much longer climbing time. 

 

Having several modes would split this small population even more. Not a solution. 

 

Player who like world of warplanes will like any version of it. Player who like to complain will always find some reason to do so. 

 

The more planes the longer it takes to get taken out, as everyone has to play saver. Just run in and die was never an option neither in co quest.

Like I stated above 2 modes will in the first days split the population, sure. But in mid and long terms, it will increase overall population. I am with you that there always will be a small risk, but without risking sth you won‘t get more ppl into the game. Do we currently have millions of players? No? So leaving the game how it is is no choice of getting more/new players.

Sure ppl who like to complain will always be there! And ppl who like WoWp will always be here. But just being here isn‘t enough. Daily I see players leaving. Sure bugs are a fierce problem too, but the game mode isn’t very addictive to everyone and at the very last you want many ppl to be here and play AND spend their money.

Btw. Yes dev team is small, but the main task in making game modes aren’t devs. You just need designers for maps (who are doing whales etc currently, so nothing very innovative). The code is already there. Engine 2.0. Bots, GT designs, even the point system should be backed up somewhere. It’s just placing everything on the map in the right place. Rest is 1 week of putting all together. Testing will be done on public test servers. Bugfixing afterwards.

 

surely the main tasks/bugs of the current version needs to be fixed before any new content should come.

 

greetings,

BiBa


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zen_monk_ #38 Posted 13 July 2018 - 09:06 AM

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View PostBiBaBummsebiene, on 13 July 2018 - 08:27 AM, said:

No, as Dreambill said: it‘s about a mode: TDM, no respawn, no refill, no conquering. Those who love conquest can still play it without any further aspects. It’s about giving a part of the community their beloved mode. (-> less whine threats + more satisfied faces)

 

For what it's worth, I fully support this.

 

Don't touch the game as it is right now, just open this possibility too and we'll all be singing Marley around the beach fire.



Dhilys #39 Posted 13 July 2018 - 09:46 AM

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the problem isn't just the bots.  The bigger issue are asymmetrical maps and the limited role the player has ( plane types vs base type) , in theory and with a big PB it can result in a fluent changing game as people have several ways to win the match.

 

However currently because the bots can't handle that way of strategic thinking and the player has no reliable way to "control the bot's thinking"  you get stuck in a predictable stagnant game. and that is severely handicapping the game. Because you as a player are severely limited in influencing the gameflow. so in short the 2 biggest possible positives have become the game worst enemy.



BiBaBummsebiene #40 Posted 13 July 2018 - 11:16 AM

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View Postzen_monk_, on 13 July 2018 - 09:06 AM, said:

Don't touch the game as it is right now, just open this possibility too and we'll all be singing Marley around the beach fire.

:teethhappy: I doubt this Marley thing will ever happen as the trenches after all the discussions became a bit too deep. A simple reduction of the hate between conquest and hardcore-mode fans would already do it :honoring:

(and I don't like Marley songs :hiding:)


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