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Bomber Escort Game Mode


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Poll: Bomber Escort Game Mode (24 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 5 battle in order to participate this poll.

How comfortable is the game mode to play?

  1. The mode is comfortable enough (1 vote [4.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 4.17%

  2. Bomber Escort Mode needs some alterations and re-work (15 votes [62.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 62.50%

  3. This mode is completely uncomfortable, it needs to be disabled (8 votes [33.33%])

    Percentage of vote: 33.33%

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eekeeboo #1 Posted 05 October 2018 - 07:58 AM

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Greetings Pilots, 

 

We would like specific feedback for the Bomber escort game mode. To help communicate this feedback more clearly we would appreciate if you could follow this format:

 

How comfortable is it to play? Do you feel it needs a re-work?

 

1.            The mode is comfortable enough, it does not need any re-work or alterations.  

2.            Bomber Escort Mode needs some alterations and re-work. (Please specify what in particular you feel requires attention)

3.            This mode is completely uncomfortable, it needs to be disabled. (Please describe your main reasons.)

 

Please, start your post with the number correlating to your opinion, with the line "I've chosen point . . ." then provide the required the additional information (your opinion). 

 

Please remain on topic and adhere to the format. 

 

Thank-you for your time and comments. :honoring:



klbergmen #2 Posted 05 October 2018 - 08:42 AM

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I like the mode but its totally unbalanced and favors the attacking team. Currently my advice is to team up with somebody, one takes a bomber or GA to be in the attacking team and you can easily farm wins. I guess in ca 25 games you can get the 5 wins for 4 classes.

My advice for the defending team is to defend the strongholds. They can take out most of the bombers and then you only have to kill the remaining few. Some of the strongholds even fire at two bomber flights.

I think the strongholds should be a bit stronger (they are too easy to destroy) and the bombers maybe a bit weaker. The structures in the stronghold are pretty hard and the targets (the one that give cap points) are big. I don't think they should be made stronger, just add more of them, make the stronghold bigger.

 

What is this with the limited respawns in the end ? How is this calculated ?

 

The lag and kickouts from battle are a serious problem.

 

Everybody should get compensated with a few days premium because we are not paying customers but unpayed testers. Shame on WG for this.I can understand that it's hard to test load but that this mode is not balanced should have been identified before release. 



jabbasDaD #3 Posted 05 October 2018 - 09:06 AM

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I like the mode in General. to equal disadvantages für defenders:

 

make the fortifications stronger. AA has no effect to Bombers, because of being destroyed before Bombers reach the Zone. Give it more Armor. so attacker GA/ Bombers Need more time, are longer busy with their Task and could intercepted.

 

reduce number of Bombers. The flights are too numerous if there are two or three flights arriving nearly the same time. Defenders Need some time to react and there is no Long time experienced battle Group but mixed random Players and bots. on the other Hand give Bombers more protection like armor or better gunners, so ist not too easy to shoot them down. and as a side effect, you reduce These enormous Peaks for the winning defenders Team with 10thousands of Points.



Smeggo #4 Posted 05 October 2018 - 09:15 AM

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I basically like the mode very much, the combat is intense and focused around the bombers.

Sadly my FPS drops below 15 after some minutes, making the game unplayable - although playing on a high-end PC. :(



Horcan #5 Posted 05 October 2018 - 09:35 AM

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The game mode is definetly a good addition, its something different from the regular games, but that often lead to frustration as many people have absolutely no clue what to do, and everything is linked together and require different plane classes to actually do what they are meant to do. Attack team should clear AA fast, or they shred bombers very fast ( they seem to do a lot more damage to bombers than team members ) and protect the bombers, while obviously the defense team have to do the opposite. A player alone, regardless of how good he is , cant be same time close to the ground and at bombers altitude, so if you team sucks , its just frustration over and over, because no matter how good you play, a single mistakes means game over, since 10 bombers can one shot your objective and when they are 3 groups, you simply cant be everywhere.Even when people will start to figure mode out, it will probably be a matter of who has better humans.

Some problems that i noticed:

-defense bases seems to fall too fast , especially tier 6+ where IL line starts.

-defense bots seems to be broken, most of the games, after several minutes, 3-4 defense bots have 200-500 points, while every attack side bots have at least 2-3k.

-you are randomly kicked out of games, with plane stuck in battle ( seems to get fixed with restart game and clear cache ) and everything you did in battle lost ( lost a game that crashed when battle ended and i didnt get progress for heavy fighter mission 2 with kills ).

So without a proper population, i dont see how this mode will work, 1-2 humans less at the start ( quit or crash ) leads to nothing but frustration and waste of time, since the battles seems to take longer, and to win you need whole team effort and proper play.

Ranks are really not balanced, they have waaaaay to big requirements ( if im not mistaken its 7 bombers for first yellow bar in a mission, so to get it maxxed, it seems you need to kill all the bombers alone ).

-most of the times, GAA arrive at bases before the defenders.

-some maps, there are simply way too many bombers for the defense team to be able to split to destroy them, while also fighting the attacking players.

I vote for such game modes being PvE only. They simply cant be balanced for humans vs humans.


Edited by Horcan, 05 October 2018 - 10:41 AM.

Retired from this censored BS forum

raketak_ #6 Posted 05 October 2018 - 09:55 AM

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I vote 2

Problem is again balance. When you create asymmetric mode, why we cannot select side? Game in this patch allow PvE mode, we can has this in escort mode too.  And start missions with win 5 battles in unbalance mode? This is simply spiteful.

 Next, when I should defend AA guns, I prefer be there sooner that attacker.

On second side, this can be fun. But let me select if I can attack or defense. In actual setup, this is lost opportunity.



Gorzki #7 Posted 05 October 2018 - 11:26 PM

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3

 

this mode promises so much yet is broken at each stage. Wins leave the feeling of being too easy, defeats lead to frustration, that whatever you would do it wouldnt be enough anyway.

 

GAA and bombers have only to destroy AA and nothing else to do all battle, HF reign supreme, fighters are always thrown into defending team and multiroles need to guess do they need ordnance or not.

This will not change in this mode.

 

There is lot of other factors to balance

spawn points for attacking team, so defenders could intercept GAA BEFORE they reach stronghold

speed of bomber flight, so there will be more time to deal with escort and bombers

number and hp of bombers

 

but all that adjustment is difficult and prone to make the mode skewed in another direction.I just don't believe, based on experience, that it can be done

 

 


Remove the flights. No point giving statpadders another tool to grief other people.


klbergmen #8 Posted 06 October 2018 - 06:38 AM

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There are also differences in tiers. Tier 8-10 it is impossible to defend the strongholds because the IL are so strong.  There the only chance to defend is to attack the bombers directly. In lower tiers its worth to defend the strongholds.

Warpig_Poland #9 Posted 06 October 2018 - 04:44 PM

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I DO NOT like the mode. Its totally unbalanced. I never did win a game or losse a game... it was pure luck. Planes are not built to defend stronholds, tanks are. Defending strongholds does NOT do the job. ; The strongholds do not fire at bombers, they are stupid. For me, every time in the middel of the game it ends and then i have lost (defending) or won (escort) ........? Why? Looks like we are testing something new. Shame on WG for this; Not balanced should have been identified before release. 



RoussosPhenomenon #10 Posted 07 October 2018 - 09:25 AM

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I LOVE THIS CONCEPT

The first iteration of it that we are playing could do with a little bit of work... i believe that the main thing that needs to change would be to buff the AA on the strongholds. this means that no other changes in terms of balancing would need to happen.

I believe that there should also be a squall line of sorts.... just because the bombers dont get through on a defense should it be over... it should be a fight to the death, otherwise it is imperative some changes to the blueprints or "operation orders" to obtain the premium aircraft available during the event. 

EG

to earn the Vampire, I need to be able to achieve a Kozedub medal... which requires a Squall Line to complete. (I understand that i'll still be able to complete this during the week, however I shouldnt be limited to just the week to do that)

 

lastly the only other improvement not related to gameplay.... There needs to be more open and informative instructional videos for newer players... We just released this to steam and we have SO many new players being thrown into the deep end.

aside from a few streamers, some YT content and Eekeeboo's CM Streams there really isnt too much instructional stuff that encourages people to learn the game mode..


Edited by RoussosPhenomenon, 07 October 2018 - 09:27 AM.


elias_the_great #11 Posted 07 October 2018 - 01:51 PM

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Hello everyone,

 

First thing's first, this is a really nice mod,both in concept and design. However, its very unbalanced and favors the attacking team heavily! Here is why

 

Perks of the attacking team:

1.Gets to destroy AA platforms and then gets their reaspawn!This means that the attacking team is always near its bombers.

2.Has more resurve planes(what for?, i have no idea)

3.Has every type of plane on its disposal,meaning that low altitude dogfights are a no go for the defending team 90% of the time(due to the ground attack planes) and medium/high are in their favor(with the bomber formations on top).

4.They only have to deal with the enemy heavy fighters(since they are the biggest threat to the bombers).Fighters cannot deal well with the Bombers(they arent suppose to anyways)

Dissadvantages of the attacking team:

...none...

 

Perks of the defending team:

1.Have AA points as support....i guess

 

Dissadvantages of the defending team:

 1.They have to deal with everything:

  • If they dont kill bombers,they loose
  • If they dont deal with the fighters/heavy fighters/multirole fighters, they loose(cause the wont be able to shot down the bombers)
  • They have to deal with Attack Aircraft(cause if they dont,they loose their AA)
  • Bombers get more in every comming way,with the lest being in the rediculus number of 15-19
  • Their base dies if 10(!) bombers reach it

 2.Gigantic wait times for reaspawn...

 3. Fewer resurve planes

 

Why would anyone want to play as defender?Anyway,we still have one more phase of Bomb Escort and i believe that the dev team has time to make some changes.Also, i dont like just complaining about something, i am willing to offer solutions as well! Thouse would be:

  1. Smaller respawn timers for the defenders(that way, they could defend their AA installations and base easier)
  2. Remove the spawn point for the defenders when they kill the AA points,that way when they missplay and die,their bombers will die as well.
  3. Make the attacking team smaller(8-10 planes), while keeping the defending team as it is.That way the amount of threats that the defenders have to face will be slightly lower (i would say kinda fair)
  4. More AA points for the defenders(maybe 3 at the start) or larger ones. That way they would die slower and provide better support(this would also help attacking team's attack planes farm better scores).Also it would help that heir spawn timers are smaller,so the attack planes wont impact the air combat while the AA points are repairing
  5. Remove the extra resurve planes from the attackers, there is no reason,whatsoever to have this buff. The defending team could use this advantage.
  6. Make every bomber group the same number or not exceeding the amount of 15 or buff the durability of the base, so it can withstand more than 10 hits(maybe 15 or 20). Right now a single untouched bomber formation can destroy the base.Even a 50% destroyed formation one can still loose you the game.
  7. In low tiers the bomber formation spawns very far the one onother so the defending team has no time to deal with both formations at the same time(planes start to get sugnificant speed during t6-t7,before that they struggle.
  8. Give defence team the ability to change their aircraft(similarly as when you possess an airfield) That way they could change role depending on the situation(also,realisticly, the raid happens over their territory)

(You dont have to emplement all of these, just some of these (or none of these if you have better ideas :) ))

 

Also props to the dev team for making the Boxes more rewarding and i am glad they are listening :)

Thats all for now, i hope we will se this mod again, and when we do, it would be as fair and equal for both team as it can be. Lets hope for an new "Attrition" ,not a new "Invasion"


Edited by elias_the_great, 07 October 2018 - 05:32 PM.


Frateras #12 Posted 07 October 2018 - 02:30 PM

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It would be easy to balance the the modi. Just give extra boni for killed bombers. 

klbergmen #13 Posted 08 October 2018 - 08:57 AM

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In bombers the most exciting thing is to get in time to the first stronghold while at the same time gaining enough height. You drop you bombs and head for the second. There you stay until its gone, then you head for the middle and wait for respawn of two new strongholds and repeat. There are 3x2strongholds and that's it. If your team is really crapyou might get a doolittle. After some time this becomes really boring but you will have an incredible winrate.

In GA there is this mad competition against the bots and time, especially in T8-10. There is so much pressure that it was no fun for me. The second mission for GA is by far the hardest of all classes and the only one I didn't complete. But you will also have this incredible win rate.

The real fun in this mode is with fighters (light, heavy and multirole). You really have to forget about winning. You need something that is fast and has punch, turning is not so important. 

As attacker you should help out your GA but more importantly protect your bombers. Around the bombers most enemies will go for them and become easy targets. Avoid fights away from your bombers and GA, they are totally useless.

As defender I think you will have to most fun of all, even though you will loose. There are different strategies. You can defend the strongholds because they kill lots of bombers, You can attack the bombers but then you have to deal with their protection too. You can also try to sneak up on unprotected bomber wings and wreak havoc there.

To improve balance I propose the following:

1. Do not reduce the number of bombers but increase the number of bombers that have to get through to win.

2. Increase the number of structures (not buildings, the ones that give cap points) in strongholds and increase a bit the cap points required to capture them. Especially in T8-10 this is important. With more targets the GA will hopefully run out of rockets and bombs before they can complete the cap and this will slow them down. The buildings themselve are already pretty hard.

3. Create different map designs. Currently there are several maps but on all of them you have 3x2 strongholds and the same bomber paths. Only the mountains are different, everything else is the same.

 

PLEASE test this before you bring it again. You just have to simulate battles with 100% bots to get an indication about balance.


Edited by klbergmen, 08 October 2018 - 08:59 AM.


Eviscerador #14 Posted 08 October 2018 - 09:17 AM

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I like the mode, but at high tiers thanks to GAA on attack team is almost impossible to win as a defender. The only defence I won was because I was playing the XF90 and ALL the attackin humans were GAA, so I could just focus on shooting down bombers, while two guys in lights kept the enemy escorts away from my tail.

 

It needs some balance, but I guess your statistics already show that.



blackmoomba #15 Posted 08 October 2018 - 11:33 AM

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The mode is interesting... but for sure requires more tweaks, in terms of Tiers and MM.

At tiers 9-10, the MM drops 3-4 human GAAs with a lot of Firepower and huge defensive potential in the attacking team, while the defense team has a mix of humans Heavies, multiroles and fighters. Problem is, there defending team can't really defend the sectors... best case scenario they manage to delay the cap BUT the sector is already at 2/8 heavy flak guns... 2/8 makes the sector ineffective against the bomber wing. Needless to say, the MM placing a low HP fighter (jap) or low firepower (12mmMGs) makes them a liability... they get shredded to pieces by the rear gunners. The only times i lost games at t10 game as attacking GAA, was when the enemy team had a lot of firepower and focused on the bombers... helped by the random team mate crashing inside the sectors and giving them a chance.

Gotta say, the most enjoyable fights i had at t7 and t8... many of them were defenses. A bit of coordination using the chat, team-mates that understood... some of them were great defenses, some were really close wins or loses. A bit easier on the attacking side, as a heavy or fighter or multirole... i only had to escort the bombers and score a few kills above a sector to flip it.

Lower tiers was a cluster F. However, due to the lack of firepower on the GAAs, the defending team stood a chance IF they rushed to defend the sectors. The sectors manage to stay at 4-6/8 AA guns, made them very effective against the bombers. However, even this strategy could back-fire if the attacking team had a few competent fighters that helped the GAAs and the defenders died like flies. Had some games were i delayed sectors for ages, had a few were the sector got flipped in seconds due to team dying... we had all the AA guns up, and boom... 3-4 getting killed and bye-bye sector. Also, the lack of knowledge and strategic common sense makes of players makes a huge difference. Had a game, on the last attacking wave... there was one bomber wing very weak, only 3-4 bombers left, getting chase by 2 of our planes, pinged and even said in chat "Move to intercept the bigger wing" ... without exception, all the team mates and bots that spawned after me, all went toward the last 1-2 bombers... by the time, those were dead and they turned to intercept the last wing... it was too late, i had to shot down 2 more bombers alone and we would have won. Was a very frustrating loss, cuz it was lost by pure stupidity.



Killtech #16 Posted 08 October 2018 - 04:14 PM

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View PostKilltech, on 05 October 2018 - 02:47 PM, said:

my Feedback:

played with heavies last evening and could win defense 6/8 times. the few times i lost were really photo finishes (very last enemy bomber managing to get over the line to make the last structure kill with barely a third health left... because i planned my last turn slightly imperfect. i shot it down just after it crossed the line before defeat message). but that was first day an i am not sure if attackers just haven't figured out the mode enough to deal with it better. was in the attack team 3 times only and lost once though. the two i won was very quick however with the first wave. the lost was again very tight. even so i never got any "grade II" heavy fighter despite very high scores - mostly because killing bombers occupied most of my time. another reason was that i rarely get assist kills because i can mostly finish my targets - better change this heavy battle mission to assists+kills or points for damaging enemies.

 

couldn't repeat it with fighters. while playing defense i lost 4/4. insufficient firepower and speed to deal with bombers. ended mostly at 2nd wave. didn't try further as there was no point.

 

as GAA i won almost all battles. but it is terribly annoying to complete 2nd GAA event mission because game usually finishes after 1st or 2nd wave. overall 2nd event mission for GAA takes i think 14 battles while heavies i needed 3 without much effort (since i got ace every single time). also bombers 2nd mission (destroy 80 GT) is even less then regular GAA aircraft type battle mission "grade V" (lowest) needs 100 sections of GT destroyed thus earning "grade I GAA" in this mode is actually impossible...

 

overall the mode is strongly biased towards attackers team. good attackers gameplay results in very short battles with little way to progress missions. in fact missions encourage to play badly to give enemy a chance so one can score higher. that's a bad design here. 

however the mode is in principle a good idea but the lack of balance is what hampers the fun. also many mission and aircraft type battle mission criteria do not fit well how the reality how this mode plays. 

 

EDIT: suggestion: It would be a great improvement for the next phase if the bomber attack groups would be nerfed by roughly 10% both in plane numbers and in health. that would hugely help the defending team since every second they need to spend finishing one bomber group leaves them less time to handle the other and that quickly cascades into a loss. this is why i would advise to make little changes first to see which impact they have before doing something radical with unpredictable consequences. on the other hand the imbalance is very apparent so there is every reason to start tuning the event right now.

 

​i wanted to add that balance between teams seems to strongly depend on plane types in queue: if it's 50:50 between GT-focused classes (bombers, GAA) and aricombat focused ones (heavies, fighters, multiroles) then majority of air combat planes end up in defense team which makes winning much more likely. but i have found that if too many heavies and such queue then attackers get too many non-GT focused players instead of bots and chances drop for defending team significantly. 

atlasapl #17 Posted 12 October 2018 - 02:29 PM

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I really enjoyed this mode. All but 1 game I was defending. I ended up with roughly a 50% split in victory/defeat. I only played tier 5 and 6. So I cant comment on how it plays at higher tiers.

From my perspective, I don't think it needs a radical overhaul. If the attacking team has a good number of GAA's, its a struggle to get around the map quick enough to sort those out and the incoming bombers. With a mainly human team you can do that. With a good percentage of bots, I am not sure its possible.

zumbledum #18 Posted 20 October 2018 - 02:05 PM

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I've chosen point . . .2

 

I really Like this mode in a lot of ways , i love haveing different objectives for different craft types , but wil IL20's and il40's being as broken as they are they just wreck the game. seen 5 fighters laying into a an il 40 it happily ignored half our team and took the base from under us nothign anyone could do to stop it . 

 

infact the higher the tier the worst this mode gets, at tier 9-10 you can actually win defence by just taking all heavy fighters flying to the bomber span and mowing them down . GAA craft can get to the stronghold before the fighter defenders can , low altitude fighters are terrible at killing GAA aircrat because rear gunners even when human controlled do insane dps , cant miss and drop your dps by 30%  






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